Hey Pamela. Thank you for being willing to talk with me. I know we've talked
about doing an interview and some sort of a Skype call or something for some
time here since I started searching for Austin in... last summer and you went
missing in 2015 a lot has happened.... and I know you have some thoughts about my
last video that I put ou. What are those? So when you talk about you know whether
or not or where you land on in a given day on whether or not Austin is alive or
not I have to tell you that's exactly where I am so that really resonates with
me. I feel like I go through that on an ongoing basis you know I dream about it.
I think about it. It pops into my head at the oddest times but it changes for me. I
know you... in your last video you talk about, and you do... as always, your
hearts in the right place, like most people who are following the story. You
land on a conclusion and for me that's been a little bit different. I have not
been able to arrive at a conclusion that I can stick with. So I'd say that that is
for me, probably, my first response. mm-hmm You know and I think that... that is a good
response and my conclusion I have a suspicion of what I think has happened
and and it's a to a point where... where I feel like I just need to change my focus
just because I can't go out and search in the areas where I think he is. It's
it's too far, too broad of a scope. Although I am going to do some more...
probably some more searches out in the woods
- but I think it is important to note that, you know, we just don't have any
positive identification at this point and it's it's really up in the air and....
for me though personally one of the things I enjoy is being out there in the
forest and.... and interacting with our community.
You know those police in search and rescue to try to figure these things out
and know where I can look, and... and the truth is that I've done a lot of
speculation and I just it's it's not we don't know what's accurate until we find
Austin. That would be my endpoint. I would definitely say I agree with you on
that, You know for for me it's become something else and in the process at
this pointWhat's compelling.... what's most compelling to me right now is what lies
behind the top of each person who is sharing or listening to my brother's
story. And everyone who hears his story or or is active you know carefully
following it, all of those people are frequently arriving at a conclusion for
whatever reason, but in fact there is.... there really is no definitive answer, and
I and I feel like, and I've gotten to this point, that it's ok, it's ok with me
it doesn't matter to me wherever anyone lands on whether they
think my brother's alive whether they think you know what... whatever they think might
have happened, but and I like I said I go back and forth all the time and so for
me when people ask me, as they often do, what do you really think happened?
My answer is I really don't know. I mean I I really don't know.
But I would like most of all, you mentioned this you notice we were
getting started, what would you most like out of this? and it work for the new new
thought. I haven't thought of it, but I must like or my brother story to be
heard with compassion. mm-hmm Yeah I can really see that and I think that... it's
really easy to pass judgment and when I say I think I I think by some of the
stories I've heard about him and things have happened,
there, and that there might be drugs involved, which, they're, in his life there
is and I I think that a lot of people just automatically throw somebody out as
worthless or is not worth looking for because of that and that's always really
bothered me and and that's not what I'm doing.
And I completely understand, I know that I'm constantly getting all kinds of
ideas about what people think happened, all over the place of what they have...
Yeah, I've read your board. So that that is difficult and I think you and I share this similar
goal that we want to just get this story out there let people know about the
issues as much as we can even though we don't know everything that's happened
but there are my emphasis especially is safety when you're out in the wilderness
and how to not get lost, not disappear. So we have a perfect example
of what not to do in the forest when you go camping or hiking, right. I mean my
very first, when I very first started to search for my brother my husband and I,
you know, as soon as we found out we flew to Portland Oregon and then we drove on
into Skamania county sheriff's office which was kind of a surreal experience
in two ways it was scary and... and second one was it
was awe-inspiring really beautiful I mean funding restore really beautiful.
And I don't think people really get that about the Pacific Northwest ,and especially
this little corner of the Pacific Northwest, but I felt closer to my
brother in a weird way just being there because I immediately connected with me
and understood what was compelling him to go there. But you know I digress...
you know there's mechanics of the service there's how it started and then
there's you know all the space in between. What do you feel like is next?
I think my brother's story has served as... what surprised me you know when the
search began, after ten days of intensive on the ground searching, and so I'm
reminded of that when you talk about you know your earnest desire to go out into
the actual forest and find my brother. And it's funny I think that there's this
pioneering spirit in the Pacific Northwest where everyone feels that way
they just want to put their boots on and you know like physically go find someone.
It's different, you know, for me for someone like me because... I'm, you know,
that I'm not like going to the forest kind of person, my brother was, but it is
it's it sort of is daunting. That whole idea. I figure I get lost and the sheriff
basically looked at me and said, you'll get a lot, right. Like, so don't gives us one more person to look for.
For me felt more natural to try and marshal a search effort through the Facebook page and
connecting with people and using social media and whatever whatever tools are
more comfortable with. So your earnest heartfelt desire to actually physically
go find my brother and others like you in the area I can't I can't tell you
what that meant to me at the time. Because after ten days of searching we
were told my brother is gone you know if you would be very unrealistic to keep
imagining that he could possibly still be alive we've worked at all the
evidence. Yeah I can't imagine what that would be like. It's surial.
I'm going to jump back here to what the... previous comment he said about the... about Skamania
I've been amazed I've been we moved to this area because
I really enjoy the beauty of this part of Washington but I've traveled the
world and there are so many plays amazing places in the world, but this is
truly a unique place. And, getting out off the trail, even though I hiked a lot I
was I've been amazed in doing a series at just how wild this country is and
difficult and so I can you... I know you, you have to see it firsthand to believe it.
Yeah and yeah... and it just it takes extra precautions and I think that's you know
if you look at where people go missing it's often around the cities and you get
people who want to go out there and experience that, but then they're a lot
more likely if they do go out there and they're unprepared even in a small way
it can have a really big impact on their experience and unfortunately for
a number of people that's meant that they don't come back.
Yeah. So I'm sorry I didn't mean to interrupt you. No, go ahead. So you know, we
we've already touched on and I think I think you know this conversation is part
of what I think I learned by starting the search
process from my brother and kind of backtracking a little bit after an
intensive on the ground search we were told my brother, you know,no way could it
still be alive, you know, be realistic, and get on with your life, so, in so many
words, but I started the Facebook page because I couldn't quite believe it, and
it was that sentiment that you're talking about that sort of buoyed me
personally and I think others who are reading about it into looking further
however they look, you know whether it's online, whether it's investigating, where
there is putting your boots on going out into the forest so yes that was the
first amazing part of this journey for me was understanding that the second
amazing part of this journey for me was understanding that this raises a lot of
emotional issues for a lot of people. And it certainly does with me obviously, but
but on many many different levels you know you're dealing with you- do we care
as a culture? you know, what's the ring what was you know, what is the rainbow
coat, you know, who are these reainbow people out in the forestry and you you've been
really out there trying to cover all these pieces, but I just want to say I
think the stories become kind of a lightning rod for different things, you
know different things I didn't anticipate. I think it's good. It gets a
chance to talk about a lot of different stuff. That is good and I have I really
struggle with that because I'm I'm just having thoughts as I walk and look and a
lot of them can be off base or you know definitely in my own opinions and yeah I
know that there's somebody else who's really emotionally connected and I'm
trying not to get emotionally connected from my side just so that I don't...
because I think it's really easy to get wrapped up in that but I think one can't
help but try to feel something... or else I wouldn't be out there.... but. We all have a
personal connection to the story right back pain on some level everyone does
they have a day of a brother who went missing, they have a brother who had a drug
problem, they had a sister, they had a twin,
they had a sibling they themselves went through something similar, and so I've
been... um I don't know... I'm sure there's a word for in
some country but it's been like a feeling this washed over me and it's
been amazing in a way and I think maybe you're talking about the same
thing. Yes I think so, and I think too that it
stirs something maybe deep within myself and maybe some others, is that what would
happen if I went missing and am i somebody that's worth searching for and
would somebody care about me and look. And that's even in just in our day
to day lives I think so many people are looking for care and love and support in
a culture where we're actually really fragmented and split apart where and you
know and talk lonely over long distances and when somebody moves away sometimes
they're just gone and that's it and that's the end of relationship... or... so
anyhow, well, I think love and the lack of love, is a really common, excuse me, is a
really common thing that we all hold in common... that was a really bad take. Well
it makes me think of kind of your first question, which is it, you know, what what
do I think after seeing your last video? and it's funny like that I think... I
mentioned to you before we started recording,
I think I mentioned I don't care anymore where someone lands on any given day I'm
what they think - you know to me it's more about what's going on... what other
elements are going on with how they're reacting to the story, but when you look
at the story logically you might come up with an answer of no he's not out there,
much like the sheriff did, because and I say that because the police and you know
other experts, based on my research say that if it's fairly impossible to stay
missing, to disappear and say missing but my brother does not like that the
profile of that person. Typically there is someone who has, they're running from
something and he wasn't running from anything.
Hwasn't running from debt. He wasn't running from a lawsuit or you know any
sort of criminal investigation or or even a parking ticket. In fact his
girlfriend said they were very happy, so it doesn't really fit the profile of
someone who wants to disappear, and to me it doesn't fit his nature because this
question comes up all the time it doesn't fit its nature so I think
it's hard to understand the person that he is or was because, when we have the
snapshot of someone who is taking LSD on a quote, vision quest, and we see a
picture of him without you know probably food or water for a good bit maybe
slightly dehydrated in with the benefit of, you know, LSD or mushrooms, that
snapshot can be a bit misleading, um for anyone I know you know I think that if I
have a a hair day, but, this is, you know, this is
like um, on a different level of what do we think when we see someone what are we
willing to not do, because, you know they just don't... they just don't, you know, they
don't align with what we believe is you know a person who needs help
you know maybe they line with someone we think who deserves not to be helped for
whatever reason and so this is part of that lighting rod that I mentioned, you
know we're a lot of different things come up. I hope I digress too much there. No no I've
thought about that a lot too and just how we are...
it's we... we are so easy... we so easily pass judgment on others for their faults, but
you know, which one of us is really perfect and doesn't have major flaws and
we may not be a drug addict or whatever else that some other person may have, but
I guarantee if we examine each one of our lives we would have major character
defects and you know if somebody thinks they don't, that they don't, then they're
they're just not living completely in reality, so anyhow, I think we all have
humanity in common. I think. Whether we want to admit it or not we do, and I
think that you know that's been part of the learning for me. It seems like you
asked, me you know, where I personally am with the story about my brother, and you
know for me it's been, you know, I talked about everyone else on your journey and
what they might be thinking happened to my brother based on what's going on in
their life, and it's the same in a way for me... it's been, you know, it's been a
year and a half the first year is brutal I'm glad I kept searching after the
authorities told us to give up. I'm glad I kept searching because now I know he
did make it out of the area. It's been confusing since then to understand you
know it feels like there's hope, I mean at the same time there's a lot of
confusion around, around that. Whatever my brother did and his life right along I
mean he's a person. We all make mistakes. I'm not I'm not justifying anything.
That's not I'm here to do, but like you said there is a certain humanity that we
all share and what I learned is no one is above it. You know, no one... there's
no one I think that I don't think there's anyone I need I can say they
haven't in some like been touched by something similar. So true you know and I
think one of the biggest things that anybody could do to help with this right
now... I was just up talking with the
undersheriff about a different project I'm working on
coming up and it he was saying you know what we really need is a photo if you
think he's alive out there we need a photo with a date on the photo. So if
there's all... with all the people out there who are watching this series if
you think Austin is there if you think you see him take a picture and send it
to the Skamania County Sheriff's Office. Take a picture with a date somewhere
a newspaper if you can or at least snap a picture and let us know where he's got
her with the sheriff know where he's at. That would be helpful for closure it may
not change what direction he's on more but if you thought yeah yeah that would
be the biggest help in my opinion. Yeah absolutely,
So I appreciate you saying that very very very much.
I hope its been helpful for you. I just really appreciate you being willing to
to meet and talk and I know you've been willing to for a long time and so it's
so great to actually do that and thanks Pamela and I hope we can do that again.
Well, I look forward to meeting you in person and I do want to get back out there.
That would be great to see you. You too
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